GliderIreland - Ireland RC Forum - Flying Model forum in Ireland
Quadcopters / Drones / Helicopters / Rotary wings stuff => FPV => Topic started by: Richard Boyd on June 06, 2011, 08:26:59 AM
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Hi all, well I have made a first step toward FPV by building a Tcoptor.
I have had only 2 flights in windy conditions, resulting in 2 crashe :shock:
This incoming week looks like it will be calm so I intend to do abit of practise flying and try and get used to coptor flying.
(http://www.gliderireland.net/forum/images/uploads/Richard%20Boyd/P1020569-1.JPG)[/img]
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HHMMmmm is that made from an experienced ‘copter design, or a Boyd special? 8) (This looks about right so I’ll give it a try)
In my ignorance I would have thought, if your only going to use three motors, that the arms 'should' have been spaced at 60degree to each other.
Why did you choose a ‘T’ configuration Richard?
K.
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Hi Keith , this is not my design, the motors are 120 degrees spacing from each other.
I have tweeked my setup abit to try and make the coptor steady in flight.
I used higher KV motors swinging smaller 8x4 DD props.
The frame cost £4 to build , I am getting like my Scotch friend :lol:
I decided on a T coptor as I wanted some nice video shots with no motors showing.
I never flew a heli before and I understand zero things about helis.
I originally bought a controller from HobbyKing but it was fautly !!!!!!!!!
Still waiting a refund, which I will probably never get.
I then contact a guy named Jussi from Viacoptor, http://www.viacopter.eu/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&page=shop.browse&category_id=8&Itemid=53
Jussi gave me loads of advice and help.
What a difference between the chineese robbers and the EU small business's.
Jussi has some new products coming out soon !
I will be support him with my money.
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Oh,……..well I’m only an Englishman so it all seems a bit technical to me. :roll:
( I never quite got to grips with trigonometry. :( )
Can’t figure out how the motors can be 120 degrees from each other and yet the ‘copter have a ‘T’ configuration. :?:
(I know in my last posting I suggested 60 degrees,…..but I meant 120, silly me! :D )
Anyway, good luck Richard! :clap:
B.T.W. What are you intending to film,…………sunbathing beauties in their back gardens perhaps 8) ……you naughty man you :wink: !!
Keith
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How did you guess what I wanted to film :clap:
There is no keeping secrets when your around Mr. Keith
I now need to buy a new PC as my desktop is showing just frame by frame when I am editing video.
Anyone got good specs for a home build PC for editing using sony vega HD ?
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Hi Richard,
Correct me If I'm wrong but you seem to be using a controller board based on the KKapteinKuk's design on that t-copter.
Despite it may be a interesting board for normal flying and some acrobatics it may be a bot tricky for FPV.
The reason is that you'll want (at least on the beginning) some auto-level features and for that it needs accelerometers.
Almost all of the people I know doing FPV with multicopters are using the Multiwii board because of that. I also use it and the tests I've been doing with FPV when perfectly fine (even when inside a car park) due to the high stability of the board and auto-level features.
As for Sony Vegas I'd start with the requirements specs and at least double them:
Vegas Pro 10 system requirements
Microsoft® Windows® XP 32-bit SP3, Windows Vista® 32-bit or 64-bit SP2, or Windows 7 32-bit or 64-bit
2 GHz processor (multicore or multiprocessor CPU recommended for HD or stereoscopic 3D)
400 MB hard-disk space for program installation
1 GB RAM (2 GB recommended)
You'll want lots of RAM. I can't even understand why they say 1GB.... with that unless is XP, not even Windows will runs fine.
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Hi Nando, yip its a KK controller, I am new to this style of flying. I will invest in a Wii board as I progress. If I ever progress !
For FPV FLYING I intend to fly a plane. First I need to save some ££££. I will be asking you for some guidence when I have the money is in the bank.
No beers for me for a long long time.
Do you use goggles or do you work from a screen ?
This was my first flight with the coptor, thankfully I have improved alittle.
I am enjoying this style of flying below trees etc.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/v/rj7P6IpMs6o[/youtube]
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Looks good Richard, should add a new higher standard to your video shoots, well done! :clap: :clap:
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I must say I’m very impressed young Richard! :D Completely ‘homebrewed’ and a very good flight I’d say 8)
K.
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Thats pritty cool. Great job.
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I'd say you're already progressing.
Nice flying you already mastered it. :)
Sorry then, I didn't knew you plan was to do FPV with a plane.
I use goggles, I've been working to hack the MultiWii code to feed sensor data into my OSD to show a Virtual Horizon. That will help to identify the tricopter flying attitude.
Btw, for the owners of the PhoenixRC simulator and that want to try to fly a quadrocopter that is already possible. The last update adds the Gaui 330x.
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I read an interesting article the other day, (well, I found it interesting anyway) about tri & quad copters. The author recond it was better to have small diameter props rotating quickly, than large props rotating slowly.
His argument was that although small props aren’t as aerodynamically efficient as slow rotating larger props, (and therefore ’waste’ battery power) they have less kinetic energy. Therefore they can slow down or speed up more quickly and offer more immediate response to the pilots input.
Don’t know if that little gem of info is of any interest to you ’copter guys :?: . I thought I’d just throw it into the arena :roll:
K.
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I'd say you're already progressing.
Nice flying you already mastered it. :)
Sorry then, I didn't knew you plan was to do FPV with a plane.
I use goggles, I've been working to hack the MultiWii code to feed sensor data into my OSD to show a Virtual Horizon. That will help to identify the tricopter flying attitude.
Btw, for the owners of the PhoenixRC simulator and that want to try to fly a quadrocopter that is already possible. The last update adds the Gaui 330x.
Thanks for info, I need all the help I can get !!!!!!!!!
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I read an interesting article the other day, (well, I found it interesting anyway) about tri & quad copters. The author recond it was better to have small diameter props rotating quickly, than large props rotating slowly.
His argument was that although small props aren’t as aerodynamically efficient as slow rotating larger props, (and therefore ’waste’ battery power) they have less kinetic energy. Therefore they can slow down or speed up more quickly and offer more immediate response to the pilots input.
Don’t know if that little gem of info is of any interest to you ’copter guys :?: . I thought I’d just throw it into the arena :roll:
K.
Hi Keith , I used 1100 KV motors with 8x4DD props, the norm in tricoptor would be 750KV-950KV motors with 10" props.
I was working on the theory that this would make my coptor smooth for slower style of flying.
I think it works :?:
Now for an interesting observation,
I have 7 x 2100 3 cell packs.
The older packs are well used and I get about 3mins flying and then the coptor looses its steadiness, it goes completely out of trim.
When I use a new pack the coptor is rock solid for 6min .
I now need to buy several new packs. broke again
:wink:
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It seems you’ve come the same conclusion the author of the article I read did: For better control, small fast props are better than slow large ones.
Re Your older Lipo’s. I’m wondering if, being older and less able to hold their voltage under load, whether they might be adversely effecting your gyro :?: . (Assuming that you're using a gyro that it.)
These copters are not something I’d be interested in flying myself, but they do seem to offer good camera platforms.
I enjoy reading how you venture is coming along :) .
(In fact I was so impressed with your first attempt I spent yesterday morning re-cutting it to see if I could make any improvements.)(Not sure I did a very good job :oops: )
Good luck with buying 7 new 3S lipos………they aint gonna be cheap! :evil:
K.
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Keith , I have kept my coptor stupid simple, I fly it in aeroplane mode and am getting more used to its bad habits aswell as the good ones.
All part of the learning cure.
The expert here is Nando, it is great to have a more experienced and knowledgable member of the forum that came help us.
Winds are too strong here today to fly coptors and too strong for me to launch my big Fox.
I might just build another coptor so I can swap over the radio gear etc. after the next crash.
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oh yeah. These babies end up eating alot of mah's.
I'm using 1200kv with a total avg consumption of 24-32A's.
It is quite common when the LiPo starts to be discharged that the copter stops to respond properly. Usually noticeable when one or more motors need to rev up to compensate some sudden movement and they simply don't. I've let mine go doewn
a few times due to that. Now I time the usage in 6 -7min for the 2200mah packs.
Back on the prop size, it is interesting because new theories show up all the time.
I've read both, an in all cases they always provide some benefits.
For example bigger props, require less rotation for the same amount of lift and so it produces less vibrations.
In my opinion in this "game" of trying and getting better response from the motors there is a clear winner and that is the i2c ESC's. Much faster updates and better throttle resolution..
But those are expensive and for just playing around the normal ones work perfectly fine.
I recall some tests comparing motors response times and the big factor was the ESC and how fast it would react to changes in control.
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Hi Nando, very interesting comment about the ESC.
I am using cheapo ESC on the coptor. The throttle response is ok but I know from experiance with indoor planes that a smooth ESC makes a world of difference. I use a YGE esc on my pattern planes, not cheap at €90 for a 4amp esc and on my freestyle planes I use Castle Creations 10amp. These ESC made a mega difference to the way the planes fly.
I have a few 10amps CC still in there packets and was thinking down the line of making a quad coptor using komodo motors, Castle esc's and the Wii board. This would be designed around my camera.
But first it is fun and learning with the tri coptor.
I have new props to test today , I have 3 x 9x7 APC props and I am going to try them today.
By the way all my props are running normal dirrection, I donot see many shops selling CW props.
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Well that is usually the problem.
Better gear cost more and on these machines is always x3 or x4 or even more.
I have a firiend using CC ESC's and Axi motors (deluxe gear) :)
He had some issues initially to set the ESC's throttle range but after exchanging some tips he's now flying it perfectly.
I believe it was due to the CC ESC's feature that syncs up the throtle range.
If you have that gear available definetly use it with the MWC (wii board).
That one can handle 400hz update rates and should make the motors run really smooth. Unfortunalty you're not close if not I'd let you have a go on my MWC so you could feel the difference.
Regarding the ESC's most like me use the Turnigy Plush ESC's because over tests those were the ones that performed better in regards to response and smoothness of the throtle range.
But I'd go for CC as well if it wasn't so pricey.
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Yesterday I tried different props on the coptor, 9x7 APC.
The coptor aint liking the change, now it is twitchy, I have tried to adjust the gains but this aint improving the handling of the coptor.
I have some 9x4 apc prop to try today if the rain goes away.
A;so my new packs arrived so it is test time to see what packs work best for me.
I got 3 different brands to test.