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Messages - Brian

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31
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 10, 2011, 02:25:51 AM »
Quote from: "rasemote"
Quote from: "Brian"
Hi Fred,
I am just trying to explore this subject a little bit more - for me and for other pilots that have an interest.

By static moment do you mean tail plane position relative to wing cord - ie; tail moment ??. If so do they have longer than normal or shorter than normal gliders.

So the Kostez at 60g/dm\2 plus is 'outside' the normal wing loading for VTPR. I know it is big and that weight does not scale up pro-rata with size.

Brian


hello
My fuselage at the exit of the mould made 1500 gr
 for simple fact my kostez for the first flight(theft) made 7.5 for 4M
 (more the glider is heavy more it is fragile)
emplanture 480 mm salmon 300
Stab emplanture 300 salmon 190

The principle of the kostez is its key of wing and its central girder if it is to respect your serat glider at the level of your piloting to see the Magazine MRA thierry


Hello Thierry,
Merci !
Wing root cord ;480mm wing tip 300 !
Tailplane root cord 300 - tip cord 190 !  ??
(more the glider is heavy more it is fragile) - touche .
The Kostez is beautiful - tres beau ! but a bit too big for me to handle.
La femme petite pour moi - no big mamma !!
Bonne nuit .

Brian

32
Slope Soaring / Quark 2M - Back to cutting innocent trees!
« on: November 09, 2011, 14:38:25 PM »
Hi John/Richard,
Best of luck.

Brian

33
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 09, 2011, 11:50:28 AM »
Quote from: "Fred"
Hi Brian,

Not to sure how to translate that, but that would be the fuselage moment (by itself), basically where in the fuselage the most lift is generated. not to be compared with were the stability is most generated (usually at the CofG of course)
Position is critical if you want a glider that perform well on knife edge (without much, or in theory without rudder input), and is about 15 to 25% from fuselage nose (just look at all the proper vtpr glider fuselages), the tail of the fuselage generating almost no lift (your fuselage tail can be a stick, that will not change much the knife edge performances)

Then, you need to select a good profile that will work at the correct Re number you are looking for, but most specificly for VTPR, a profile that will work well in no air speed (able to do a roll with no airspeed for exemple). You can have a look at the TP series, and of course, the good old SBs. All these profiles work with a certain size of ailerons etc etc

Anyway, all that is only computer theory, you will never match the speadsheets performances of a profile etc with a build, even Boeing don't pretend that, but the goal is to get as close as possible to the "perfect" recipient. As Dassault says, if it looks good, it will fly right!  :D

On another note, I think lots of experts are talking about VTPR gliders lately (seems to have been discovered only a year or two ago...) but most, if not all the gliders they choose, compare etc, are barely VTPR gliders in the true sense of the term.
But they are great aerobatic machines. VTPR is another league, another way of flying altogether. I flew / tested tons of aerobatic gliders, but flying a glider truly designed for VTPR, is totally a different world by just the way the machine fly and react to your inputs.
Almost all aerobatic gliders can do a roll at wingspan altitude from the slope... But a handfull will do it at zero speed! I think this is the simpliest way to describe these machines.


Hi Fred,
Yes I think I understand.
In the first paragraph you are talking about fuz,, side area and side area distribution.
This is where they don't work for me.
In knife edge the fuz is the wing.
The CG should be at 30%ish, of the fuz side area.
The fuz should have a wing profile .
It should have enough side area to 'fly' in knife edge.
This side area should be effective at creating lift.

Wing profile - I agree and add that to be able to adjust camber ia good ! - 4 axis control.
For this the aileron/flap should be 30% of cord !?.

I also agree with 'a lot experts talk about VTPR gliders lately' .

I think it is a good time to try for something new - a little bit different.
I will try anyway.

Brian

34
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 09, 2011, 10:29:47 AM »
Hi Fred,
I think that this is more a 'Dark art' than a science. :shock:
There is also a 'style' aspect to the Brittany type I think.
I don't like the knife edge performance unless there is huge lift.
Thank you for your input.
We should keep this going a bit to help develop 'our' understanding.

Brian

35
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 09, 2011, 09:19:12 AM »
Hi Fred,
I am just trying to explore this subject a little bit more - for me and for other pilots that have an interest.

By static moment do you mean tail plane position relative to wing cord - ie; tail moment ??. If so do they have longer than normal or shorter than normal gliders.

So the Kostez at 60g/dm\2 plus is 'outside' the normal wing loading for VTPR. I know it is big and that weight does not scale up pro-rata with size.

Brian

36
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 08, 2011, 22:37:26 PM »
Hi John/Fred,
I'm just sticking down a few thoughts/figures for reference.
My understanding of a 'good' VTPR model is that it should be light, whatever that is ???.
The French Kostez's are 7.5/8 kg.
On the RCG thread they said they were 60g/dm\2.
My Voltij (all glass-heavy'ish) is 46g/dm\2 @ 1.65kg for a 2m.It flies good but needs some air.
The Limande is approx 40g/dm\2.
It is likely that there is a threshold wing loading where these planes go from being good (agile/lively/efficient with good energy retention) to being not so.
I have no idea where that threshold might be.
We have to be careful about adding weight for strength as the weight can become the source of the problem, eg for landing.
At an impact the energy involved is a multiple of the weight and the speed  -  ironically the heavier the wing loading the faster the landing/impact (normally/as a rule).

I am going to aim for 45 to 50g/dm\2.

Brian

37
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 08, 2011, 09:39:21 AM »
Hi Guy's,
Thank you.
I know it is not really the same.
However I have some experience of 1.5 to 2m aerobats .
I think if I can get the area right (small cord changes at a span make a big difference) for the right weight I can do do something 'new' that will fly 'big' at a size that is reasonable to handle/ carry /launch/transport etc !!.
Wing loading is wing loading !!!
I have had an idea for a fuz for a long time so we will see !.

Brian

38
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 07, 2011, 21:24:10 PM »
Hi Fred,
Thank you.
Do you know the wing area ??
I ask because I am working (early stage) on an own design 3m aerobat !!
It is something that I have had in mind for a number of years now and seeing the Kostez brought it back to mind.

Brian

39
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 07, 2011, 11:13:11 AM »
Hi Fred,
Ok thank you.
Was your one made here or in France ?
If in France maybe somebody can weigh one made here as well.!!??

Brian

40
Slope Soaring / Kostez
« on: November 05, 2011, 18:17:59 PM »
Hi John/Fred
As a matter of interest what weight are those fuz,, moldings??.
(The ones molded here).

Brian

41
Slope Soaring / Re: Tip stalling
« on: November 05, 2011, 12:43:31 PM »
Quote from: "johnfireball"
Hi all,
      Having problems flying my DG1000. I keep tipstalling it on final downwind turn to land. My Dad suggests that my turn is too flat and to put in loads of bank. He says the full size ASK6 was notorious for this and many were crashed on finals. Do models behave the same? Hopefully will try again on Saturday. Had some great flying last weekend at killakee with my phase, strongest winds I've yet flown in 30 knots +gusty, was great to learn to fly backwards and so easy to land. Course I broke it eventually but got a good hours flying.
John


Hi,
Where is your CG ??
Can you or do you use spoileron on landing ??

Brian

42
Slope Soaring / Quark 2M - Back to cutting innocent trees!
« on: October 28, 2011, 23:31:30 PM »
Fred,
Thank you.
I did ask on the toons thread.
Back to Quark.

Brian

43
Slope Soaring / Quark 2M - Back to cutting innocent trees!
« on: October 28, 2011, 21:41:36 PM »
Quote from: "Happy Days"
Quote from: "Brian"
Hi,
Mine will be 3M  :shock:
???????

Brian


That's gonna make for rather a high wing loading isn't it Brian?

K.


Keith,
That might be the chord  :shock:  :shock:  :?:
Dunno Fred ,I'm staying stumm  :wink:

Seriously though are those available ?? from who?? how?

Brian

44
Slope Soaring / Quark 2M - Back to cutting innocent trees!
« on: October 28, 2011, 18:24:03 PM »
Hi,
Mine will be 3M  :shock:
???????

Brian

45
Slope Soaring / google warnings
« on: October 28, 2011, 15:10:26 PM »
Hi,
I'm not getting a warning but my little lap top has been freezing up a bit ??.
I think it's been after I clicked on a 'daily motion vid'.
When it happens I can't activate the curser in the address window ???

Brian

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